Early preview and all, but it seems to me that it hits the worst possible combination of an overall convoluted and chaotic look, while the same time offering very little content with the huge pictures.

But maybe this is just the impression you get on a smaller laptop screen ;)

i Got the same fright from the iPad.:) like the scrolling text though.

I like that you've cleaned up the look of the header area by bringing the links and the logo into the same box.

The scrolling forum posts just make it take longer to see if there's any recent topics I'm interested in, and the motion draws attention away from the art. Also, I don't see any other way to get to the forum.

The animated previews are a good idea, but probably shouldn't be moving by default. Motion strongly draws the eye, making it difficult to focus on anything else. It would be way too much if all the previews on the page animated, and it's very possible that this could happen. Either a button to start the preview, or only having images animate when you hover over them would fix this.

The larger images are fantastic. I always though the old design had the previews too small. However, it's hard to see where one preview ends and another begins, especially when they have similar background colors. Adding a little margin would help a lot to make it feel less crowded and chaotic.

I'm not sure what the menu in the lower right corner is for. The icon is what's normally used when the header is hidden inside a drop down menu, but it seems to be the most recent site news instead. It's really kind of confusing.

It's super nice that the page fits on mobile screens.

Overall, I like the direction. With a few changes and a little polish it will be way better than the current site.

I personally dont see that much wrong with the current layout, maybe a bit of moving around maybe. scrolling banners i think would work well, i had a mess about with paint. :)

the bugs are the most problems i think, and some newer features.

you could have the animated gifs work on rollover 

you could have the banners all the way down with seperated categories, 2d,3d,fonts and music, music could have a Play all from the latest section that plays constanly whilst browsing the site, optional of coarse. im just throwing things out there now, hahaha

Sorry, but I have to agree with the previous reviews.

• Picture size is too large (and isn't aligned with description text).  maybe give people an "accessible" option that includes larger thumbs, but default size shouldn't really be any more than 200x200 (that might even be too big).
• I see two "Popular This Week" headings...they took up so much space I even notice pages were loading below them.  I'd recommend making that collapsable so people can minimize it.
• Like the scroll, but can you add an "opt-out"?  Check out Unity User Forums for an example: it allows you to close a headline/ticker announcement

Agree with everything that's been said, particularly chasersgaming and Boom Shaka. I don't really feel like there's anything wrong with the layout of the site right now---it seems like bugs and maintainability are a much bigger issue. Mobile responsiveness of some kind feels like it's missing from the current frontpage. 

That said, I like chasersgaming's mockup. Seems like now might be a good time to add a few niceties while focusing on cleaning up the backend. 

Also just want to say thank you so much for what you're doing, and for all of your efforts maintaining the site. It's thankless but much-needed.

I'm excited to hear OGA will be getting an update!

I like @chasergaming's design with the left-right scroll. I think it would be even better if you split up the latest art by categories, like you do on the "Latest Art" page. So instead of having 1 row for latest art, have 1 row for "Latest 2D art", another for "Latest 3D art", etc... Looking at amazon.com right now, that is similar to how they do it, where they have popular/featured content on top, then rows for different categories of products.

My thoughts on your numbered list:

1) I think starting the animation on hover would be great. It looks like a common way to achieve this is to have both a static and animated image, and use javascript to swap which one is displayed based on hover (https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7473117/animating-a-gif-on-hover)

2) n/c

3) Using the 3-bars icon for news is a little confusing for me. Like @BenCreating says, I am used to that being a replacement for the top menu, especially in responsive websites, such that when the window is made too small to show the full top menu, it all gets hidden, and can be shown by clicking on that icon. It's not straightforward to use it for news.

4) I had never seen "Who's online" before, but I do look at the recent comments and recent forum posts whenever I visit the site, and would like that to be maintained somewhere easy to get to (prefereably not the scrolling marquee at the top).

5) I agree with all of this. I also really don't like how the previews span 100% of the window width, I really like having margins on the left and right, like is the case now. When I visit sites like amazon or youtube, they have pretty big borders that actually help me focus on the conent, rather than be overwhelmed like I am when I visit the new page now. (See point 8 for my thoughts on a left/right button)

6) I didn't really like the scrolling marquee, because I didn't want to have to wait to read all the recent posts/etc.

7) n/c

8) To help the layout be more uniform, I wonder if the upload page could have an image crop widget, such that the crop area has a fixed aspect ratio, but the user could position/enlarge/shrink it. That way previews whose proportions don't work well for the front landing page would all be cropped down (allowing the user to choose what part is shown), while the page for the actual submission would show the whole preview image. There could be some default crop for users that don't set it themselves. I don't think this would work well with the left/right buttons you propose in point 5 though, unless he user picks a crop for EVERY preview image they upload. It also might not work well with future site layouts, where you want to change the aspect ratio of preview images on the landing page.

@botanic, yes I get that buddy, but I didn't want to take anything away from the mock up, but your quite right, more art. So how about having the comments,forum comments,leaderboards favourite submitters etc 'tabbed' in a side bar?, a sidebar that is closable or appears on rollover.art images could be expanded on rollover to 'full size' and play animation if it has one, now 'full size' would ultimately be whatever size the upload was/is? If image sizes are problematic then it may be a suggestion that OGA has a restriction in place for preview images, now I don't actually like that idea, I hate having to resize images to fit a restriction, but if it can be automated like it is now then it shouldn't be to much of a problem, everywhere else has a recommendation, maybe that would be better to best showcase the art and keep OGA consistently looking. Rollover seems to be my favourite word,Hahaha, why I like about rollover experiances is it keeps thing simple and tidy without losing the information, it's there you just have to move the mouse, or in terms of mobile friendly, a finger touch away and is totally a user optional feature whether they want to see the information,or just look at the art.

i like the banner scrolling and I would maybe prefer the catagorys separated like @Dezradragons suggests.

sorry, I do waffle on sometimes, :)

Riff on @chasersgaming's design with tips from @DezrasDragons. Mostly non-functional so probably not useful. That said maybe you guys can make some of it out. version with no shadows here.

Haha! I kept trying to zoom in on that mockup, pistachio.

I like that mockup. Personally, I think no left sidebar as shown in chaser's example is slightly better; one of the main problems the current layout has IMO is not enough room to show off the art. We have 3 fairly important categories (popular this week, newest art, and featured art) but only the first two can be seen without scrolling around, and only 8 at most in each category are visible. The more room there is to show off art, the better IMO. 

After looking at these mockups, I do think one sidebar to show stuff like recent posts, popular collections, etc is a good thing if we can fit it. 

@Botanic. Didn't mean to leave all of this on you. I'm just getting back to a point where I can dig into that stuff and help out. :)

Moving pictures on hover like on porn sites.

@Botanic: you commited in git as "root"

What I would like to see: (not design; totally overkill)

• WebGL preview for 3D art
• Integrated character generator if submission, which have the right format ... maybe even for collections
• Better player for sounds
• Submission dependencies for better attribution generation (this is based on submission X and X is based on Y and Z)
• Unicode /o\

I do not really care for the frontpage, but maybe it would be nice to customize it with filters.

I only care for 2D and I guess some are more into 3D.

Maybe pinning searches to the front.

I don't know how to describe it, but the design makes it hard to focus. I think it would look good with a menu/title that is easier to distinguish from the art content (different background colors or something) and one side bar that can kind of condense the important parts from the current two sidebar design. I like the banner idea that chasersgaming mentioned for the art categories where the user can scroll left and right. If there would be animated previews, please only allow it when hovering over it.

Thanks for taking the time to make a preview and letting us give feedback!

I like it, but I think the images are a bit too big. I also don't think that the previews fit in, they should have a border to look nicer. Just my opinion!

It has nothing to do with your laptop because it also looks like a complete nighmare on a 1080p 39" monitor. It looks like something optimized for mobile devices except no one is developing directly on those unless you count an RPi3, which then you're running it like a desktop, so I don't understand the point. I wish people would stop trying to fix things that were never broke. It's just going to be like Reddit in which people prefer the older interface. I think the current look is perfect. I smell a young web dev trying to sneak in some kind of JS tracking nightmare. If that happens, I'm not going to bother wasting my time learning a new interface after experiencing the ease of what we already have. There's a reason DeviantArt still looks the same as it did 10 years ago; "Keep It Simple Stupid" and don't fix it if it's not broke.

Also, maybe instead of adding complicated 3D previewing features, people could just upload a model to Sketchfab and then embed it here but it seems as though OpenGameArt blocks iframes.

@TheOuterLinux Some of this, I agree with. The JS, I'm with you on that. Without going into why, a lot of the web is a bloated dependency nightmare and this current mockup hits most or all of those bad notes.

Unfortunately "if it ain't broke" is generally not applying to high tech/web design, or some modern industry like this. Everything moves fast and if you don't fix it they break you eventually. I have no idea how DA is still hanging on, probably it had most changes under the hood. Also in fact parts of the current interface could be a hell of a lot simpler. Most of it works, some of it doesn't. Points there have already been raised, and I tried to bring some of those here in my mockup.

Mine so far are pretty wide reaching. Better organization of categories (user, news etc), put that in a hierarchy. In my mock I think I tried to put the social networking buttons with email/IRC as example. Who's Online probably goes in the forum. But when you group things like that there's more room to put art and its stats in your face.

Devs! I don't know how you're implementing this but don't make it a bloated dependency nightmare, code tight.

@MedicineStorm Years of pushing small-ass pixels on sub-HD displays will do that to a man.
I'll probably make one for info page or user page, but waaay down the line. Zoom in on that.

TheOuterLinux: "don't fix it if it's not broke."

It is broken. That's why we're doing this. I'm guessing your recommendation is 'I prefer the new layout to be as much like the current layout as possible'? That could be useful feedback. Are you saying there is nothing about the current layout you would change? Keep in mind this isn't an adjustment to the current layout, it's a replacement; It's possible (although more difficult)  to replace the current layout with a layout that is nearly identical, but the site code has to change either way. New layout features are easy to make now, and not as easy later.

I might actually have a go at this Drupal and experiment with an OGA mock up type thing, and see if I can get anything to work.if there are no objections? Won't effect anything here, just so you know.

I'd just like to request that everyone keep the feedback positive and constructive. Botanic (and MedicineStorm, and so on) is doing this for free, as a hobby. They are trying to fix a system which is becoming difficult to maintain. That maintenance is necessary to keep this amazing resource available. Let's remember that OGA benefits us all and most of us don't pay for it, so the least we can do is be courteous to those who are trying to take care of it. 

Thanks to everyone!

I want to vote for Basto's idea about submission dependencies. It would be REALLY great to explicitly track which submissions/works a submission is derived from; this could help automatically generate attributions (like with a collection, but you could "follow" the graph of attributions to identify all the works a given submission borrows from), and also to check for license compatibility. 

Hi, I just checked and I find it confusing and a bit chaotic :(.

I think we should focus on a simple clear landing page, to add constructive criticisim I made a quick concept in inkscape of what it could be

https://opengameart.org/content/concept-for-open-game-art

Ok, my two cents:

1) I like the bigger preview pictures.  I do think they need a border of some kind around them but certainly there is a happy medium between having no borders and the current display which uses about 50% of the available space for borders.

2) I don't like pistachio or chasersgaming's mock ups.  Nothing wrong with them really, but they are both far too close to the current setup which works just fine as is.  To me those mockups would be just change for the sake of change.  That's not to say they don't offer some improvements over the current setup, but really just not enough to make them worth the effort.  My advice would be, if you are going to alter the site have a good, strong idea to serve as a guiding light for your changes.  For example, 'showing off the art better' or 'highlighting the community more' or 'minimalist & clutter free'.  Set this as your goal and re-work everything around that one idea and see where it takes you.  The current site is definitely a pretty good 'jack of all trades' design, so if you're going to change it, I'd say be bold, pick a direction and lean into it.  There's no point in re-working everything just to come up with another 'does lots of things well but nothing great' design.

Ok, I'll make it 3 cents and say 'who is online' can definitley get the axe IMHO.  ;)

"those mockups would be just change for the sake of change...not enough to make them worth the effort."

This isn't really a factor this time; We aren't modifying the current layout. We're starting from scratch on a new framework. Building it identical to the old layout is not neccessarily any less effort than building it entirely different. The goal is also not neccessarily to have something totally new and different. It is just an opportunity to make some changes while we're building it from scratch. 

@MedicineStorm:  For the coders maybe, but you also have to consider the work for all the users.  Alot of us have been using this site for a long time, why force everyone to learn a brand new layout if it only marginally improves on the old one?

Honestly, even for the coders, using the existing layout will be easier because all the design questions are answered for you.  'Where do the recent comments go?', 'What font point should we use for the headers?', 'Should the title go above or below the art preview?', 'Where do the social media links go?', 'How many preview images per line?', 'How many lines per preview category?'  You get the idea.   I get where trying to mimic every last detail of the current site might be a pain, sometimes things done with one layout language are harder to achieve with another and dredging up the exact fonts and colors used might be a non-trivial task.  But still, no doubt it will be easier to target the existing layout than come up with a brand new one.  This is especially true when you consider that there's more than just the front page involved, there's the search pages, submission and forum views, user profile pages, message center, etc. etc.

On top of that, makes changes and be prepared to field an endless stream of 'why did you move xyz?' or 'what happend to the blah blah link?' questions.  You can see some of those sentiments floating up here and this is just a preview that users had to go out of their way to look at.  Expect it to be alot worse when the main page changes and every user is confronted with a new layout.

Not trying to knock the OGA3 efforts or disuade anyone from trying to improve the site.  Just saying that if you're going to change things, make it worth while.  The current layout works well enough as is.  There's no point in just pushing things around the page a bit.

About making things work better on mobile.  The current site is obviously designed for desktop without even a thought to mobile, and yet I have never had a problem navigating it on my (now considered luaghably tiny) 4" iPhone.  The problem I have had is that I can no longer post messages from my phone.  No idea why this is, it used to work, I think maybe the site takes so long to respond to the post query that the phone gives up on it?   So just to re-iterate what some have said already, I'd much rather work went into bug fixes and general site maintenance than page layout and site redesign.

@withthelove: Good points. I just wanted to clarify that I was not opposing the suggestion that OGA3 have a layout similar to OGA2, only that doing so is unlikely to save coding time. The time saved reusing design elements from OGA2 is unlikely to make up for time lost trying to translate incompatible features between OGA2 and OGA3. I see you were referring more to the effort involved in users learning a new system.

I am all for making changes carry enough improvement to overcome the distaste that comes with new interfaces. :) Again, I'm not against any of the suggested layouts, I just don't want people basing their decision on invalid assumptions about effort involved. To clarify what I was trying to say:

• Creating OGA3 from scratch will take too much effort. Let's instead keep OGA2 and just fix the bugs. = Invalid assumption.
• The site's bugs cannot be fixed until OGA3 is created. Regardless of layout, coding effort remains approximately constant. This is true even if OGA3 is: a) identical to OGA2, b) completely different from OGA2, or c) just pushed around the page a bit.

@MedicineStorm:  Gotcha. 

Are you all to the point where you need a design to forward or is there still more backend work to be done before a page layout is an absolute requirment?  

If you've time for it, might I suggest a 'Design Your OGA Home Page' Art Challenge?  I wouldn't bind yourselves to going with the winning entry, but it might be a fun challenge and good way to get the community talking about and prepared for the change.

Okay so after a couple of hours, I just did a very rough concept. You can check it out here:

https://samuncle.github.io/opengameart-new-gui/

The code is on github, you are welcome to give your feedback: https://github.com/samuncle/opengameart-new-gui

I used bootstrap so it's easy to have it responsive without doing much.

:)

@samuncle:  I like it!     Should 'latest art' be up front instead of 'featured art'?   I can see lots of little problems but you did say it was a very rough concept and as a bold new direction I like it.  It certainly accomplishes the goal of hiding the clutter and highlighting the art.

A general thought to toss out there, does it make sense to separate the visual from the audio submissions on these pages?   The current site just kind of lumps the two together, but for these designs that blow up the preview pictures, maybe it makes more sense to have a separate section or colomn for audio submissions.   Obviously, you'd want to do it in a way that didn't appear to de-emphasize audio works, just thinking that a screen filled with giant 'Play' icons isn't going to look real hot.

I also like it. The look is sharp and appealing. As I mentioned elsewhere, I think we might need more than just 2 submissions visible on the front page, but I can definitely get behind the immediate visual appeal. I think having smaller, but more, audio preview buttons down the side or something may work for the audio submissions. Since large play buttons don't help for audio, we could substitute quantity for quality that way?

Not sure why you are all trying to start something from scratch... there are excellent themes available for Drupal that could be forked.

Just have a look at some image gid heavy themes like these:

https://www.drupal.org/project/yg_news

https://www.drupal.org/project/premier_league

Or a searchable catalog like theme:

https://www.drupal.org/project/used_cars

by "starting from scratch" I mean, "not using any component of the current layout". Definitely not opposed to drupal8 compatible layouts. however, OGA has some pretty customized features of it's layout. The DAM plugin you pointed out is a good start, but no precrafted layout has all the things we need, so there is likely to be some manual building of features still.

ugh, that 'Used Car' preview really highlights my one major concern with samuncle's mock up: It looks like a place you go to get stuff, not a place where you go to participate in a community.   I'm sure the current layout brings tears to the eyes of graphic designers everywhere, but I'll say this, it does mange to look more like a hub or portal into an interesting community than a place a where you go to get some free stuff.

Hi everyone,

I took some time to adjust the concepts based on your feedback. I added more thumbnails to showcase the artwork of the week and the latest artwork submitted by users.

"It looks like a place you go to get stuff, not a place where you go to participate in a community."

In my humble opinion, the current layout of the website looks confusing. When you come for the first time on the landing page, you just see a bunch of pictures that don't give a hint of what makes this website amazing. The only clue you get is the one from the title itself, OpenGameArt. In my design, I tried to make sure to put an emphasis on two things:

1. This website allows you to discover, share and download open source assets for your own game.

2. By placing bigger pictures, I'd like to give people a bigger preview and encourage our contributors to create amazing art.

I'd also like to point out that this concept is only meant to give you a direction. I didn't really want to focus on the titles, the amount of pictures..., but more on the colour palette, the general layout and making sure not to confuse users. I'm glad that you are willing to consider using my design as a base for the new website. For me, OpenGameArt is one of the key websites that I use almost on a daily basis to download art for my own project, SuperTuxKart.

Therefore, it was natural to give something back to the community. I have designed a few websites and I have experience in graphical user interface. It would be a pleasure for me to bring my experience and knowledge to improve this website.

Thank you very much for all your feedback and you can check the newest version here.

Sam

Let's not forget about music guys and gals, all aspects that are available here should be displayed straight from the landing page, it's should be Spaced out fairly for the catagorys, and the less scrolling the better in my honest opinion. 

I can't get cPanel to work, so I can't do mock up without paint or something. I would decicate the landing page to the assets, lose the text, and in one of the tabs next to home have 'community' replacing forum? and have the page dedicated to all things from the community, so moving all the text from the front page now,recent comments etc, and have them all based in the community page, forum posts, recent comments etc, maybe sticky some such as, 'show of your project' FAQs, admin posts, collections and tutorials will be a good one to have as a sticky. That's how I would do it anyway.

@sam - new version looks a LOT better!

I'd still like to see recent community comments and new/popular collections in a side bar.  I viewd it in my phone (Galaxy S8 standard) as well, and think you could probably get away with reducing the preview picks to 65-70% of this example without compromising the quality at all.  That might mean fitting four images in a row instead of just three and/or viewing both "Popular" and "Latest" categories in a single screen view.

Good work samuncle! Very clean and easy to navigate.

I agree with the others that I'd like to see recent comments and forum posts somewhere. I love the prominent search bar, but I'd love to see an equally visible Submit Art button. The site is for both finding and sharing assets, after all.

Very good observation. I just made a rough change, it could be interesting way to promote the website and encourage sharing artwork

Like the /share/ change, that was kind of what I was getting at with my used car page comment.

I'll second Boom Shaka's request to work the community stuff back in there somehow.  Think about stuff like the Art Challenges and Game Jam, where is the place to announce/promote those things?   

I'll add that in my time on OGA there are countless discussions I never would have seen or gotten involved in if it hadn't been for all that stuff being on the front page.  Now that I'm more familiar with the site, it wouldn't be a big deal to have to check a separate 'community' page to see all that stuff, but thinking back to when I first started visiting the site, not sure I would have ever taken that extra step of getting involved with the community of it hadn't been for some comments or forum threads catching my eye on the main page.

So I definitley see the point that all that stuff can look like clutter and confuse new users, but it does serve a real purpose for the site and the OGA community.  I think the design challenge is trying to work it in there in a way that doesn't despoil the clean look you are going for.

> current layout of the website looks confusing

For better or worse, the current layout is very much a 'dashboard' style page.  It crams a lot of info into one page.  Totally get where that can be confusing, but it does have the strength of allowing you to quickly see almost everything that's going on with the site at any given time. 

> the color palette

I think it could go quite a bit lighter, more like the current layout.  But I do see where you have reduced the /number/ of colors which definitely does help make it less busy.

I like it! I think a different color for the share button would better signal that it's not a search box, though.

i couldn't do the drupal thing, so i had a mess about with Wix, as its the one i use for my site. nothing works, its only a visual demo of what i invisioned. didnt get a chance to do anything with images, like mouse rollover as i just dont have the time now. anyways, it was good fun having a play around with web design. :)

https://chasersgaming.wixsite.com/mysite

@withthelove If the front end of the layout works, keep it. That was my rationale and I don't see how it contradicts our goals. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if it's clean and stable under the hood which we're doing anyway you can mess around with the shiny stuff more later.

@samuncle Nice rebranding, bad redesign. Maybe the all-out route is what we need, but I'm not a CEO making 5 year plans, so my thoughts are only sort of formed on that.

Maybe it's just me, but I think currently Samuncle's layout looks very generic, almost like one of those domain squatting pages :p

And I agree, it needs more direct access to the community features.

Initial thoughts, away from questions you asked.

Well, granting it's almost always NSFW, I always rather liked Furaffinity's index. With, again, the note that quality control on SFW vs NSFW is bad on the site before you click it.

http://www.furaffinity.net/

Notice how the site has the header bar, then the ads, then literally it's just sorted bins of previews. This straight, low-nonsense approach seems close to what you're wanting.

Free-form arrangments of previews (like the one that site preview seems to be) are better at cramming a lot into very little space, but they're a headache inducing eyesore to any semblance of order or organization. I think it says a lot that DeviantArt uses a comparable ordered presentation on their front page; in their case, there is a fixed height and then everything is thumbnailed in scale to maintain that. I would say anything more free flowing than this and it's going to be an eyesore.

1) people can post animated previews currently, should we keep the rendering them out to a static png or let people actually see the previews that are posted? Is there a way anyone knows of to deal with this? Maby allow animation on hover? Anyone know how can that be accomplished?

I've heard people complain about animation on hover as being tempermental on mobile (this is on Discord's client apparently), but the basic, zero-frills way of doing it is pretty straightforward; here's a codepen with it in it for reference. https://codepen.io/QDeltaE/pen/VWGYOB

2) There will be a forum menu item I just haven't added that yet, the menus' will stay basically the same

Dropdown menus are great at tucking navlinks together as long as they can be sorted. I have nothing to offer beyond the obvious here.

3) I think I will move the news button to the top middle as a pull-down

Post-submit edit - the next three paragraphs are supposed to be struckthrough, but for whatever reason the submitted version doesn't display it. I left them here in case they were useful or wound up context for things said later in this comment; they can be, otherwise, disregarded.

It varies, but for example, FurAffinity assumes that users are more likely to browse than submit, yet both functions are important to the site; therefore, "Browse" comes first in the navigation header, followed directly by "Submit". DeviantArt, on the other hand, wants people to post their art and to make it as straightforward as possible to do so; although the presentation is mixed based on a combination of what DA wants you to do and what it assumes you will want to do, "Submit" is a highlighted action in the navbar.

Given my experience of the site, I would assert that FurAffinity's model is correct; and also that you seem to have that already set (now that I finally scrolled up to check). I don't know what it is you hope to accomplish by changing the ordering.

It's also important never to disturb workflows without good reason. It's getting quite tiresome to point this out to company after company. I doubt that submitting art on OGA is a live-or-die proposition for anyone who comes here, but I would prefer to see it not change so much that people are bewildered until they adjust just in time to wreck it again with OGA v4. Figure out what you want to establish as the navigational flow and stick with it, whatever it may be.

Pre-submit edit: Christ I'm tired. I just realized I'm going on about the submit button and you're talking about news. I got nothing and I'm tired of writing at this point.

4) @chasersgaming the idea is to bring more prominence to the art, not all the other items, currently things like "who's online" does that really matter to anyone?

"Who's Online" is a social feature. So if you're asking me, be aware I'm not here to socialize. I'm here to find art that I find interesting, or potentially find artists that I could hurl money at to get work I need done. I suspect that's not shared with the people who keep OGA running.

Like DeviantArt, there is likely a need to strike a balance. Being non-social, I can't begin to illustrate that nicely and neatly and packaged for you. But I can say this much: If the site needs people to come here and hire out artists and encourage them, then some part of that balance has to go to there; likewise, if the artists and creators themselves have strong desires about what the site should be, some part of the balance has to go there as well. Again: I don't know because I don't interact with what I assume to be "the other half", so to speak, very often. Research will have to be done on the matter and the site's longer term design and orchestration has to follow what it is that research says.

5) I am thinking to make the previews a bit smaller with a border around them, still larger than the current ones but smaller than now. Was also thinking to add a "left and right" preview button for if someone has more then one preview image. Thoughts?

Be very, very careful how much functionality you try to cram into the thumbnail space. The information density of many previews on site is high, but a small thumbnail isn't going to reflect that well at all. I would advise against this, and further advise considering auto-gen thumbnail from first image in preview with the option to provide a thumbnail image with a fixed presentation size.

6) I like the idea of an opt-out on the scroll, I removed the scroll for now but I think alike X or something to close it? Thoughts?

I have no clue what this refers to precisely so I'm skipping it.

7) The duplicated popular this week and stuff at the end of the page is just for testing

Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Vivamus posuere mi ex. Integer id dui semper lacus eleifend vehicula sed in leo. Pellentesque varius facilisis malesuada. Aenean egestas nulla turpis, ut efficitur nunc tempor eget. Etiam arcu nulla, ultrices non elit sit amet, placerat posuere justo. Sed in eleifend elit....

8) Should I auto zoom in on images that have bad proportions, ie 10px x 500px or stick to showing the (almost useless?) super zoomed out image?

There's no good fix for creators who submit art in such a way that it doesn't format well. Instead of worrying about how you handle this problem, accept that there will always be people who break your intended presentation, then create tools to empower the submitters to make use of your intended presentation. Custom thumbnails and a fixed size (or a size recommendation) are the solution here, as well as just biting the bullet and scaling them outright into scope if they're not properly set up.

Yes, every part of me that wants to be kind to creators cringes, too. But it's important to have some sane, stable stance and to let people conform to that instead of saying "oh, we'll just try to conform to everyone then". Trying to be too many things for too many people is a very dangerous overreach of scope, even in something as simple as thumbnailing.

nota buena: responding to a bunch of comments from different people here, I haven't attributed them all, hope that's ok.

> https://chasersgaming.wixsite.com/mysite

I actually like this one quite a bit.

The idea of sorting the front page stuff by category is great.

Only quibble, what's the difference between 'community favorites' and 'featured art'?   I'd suggest we only need one.

The current page does have a 'recent work by your friends' which would be nice to keep.

I don't know if the left/right arrows are strictly necessary.  I don't mind the current system where you see what you see on the front page and click on the list headers to see more.

Still, I like it a lot.  My favorite of the proposals so far.  I think you could take this design, add the community side bars back in, restore the current top menu bar under the title, and you would have a really great refresh that brings a new look and idea to the website without completely upending it.  And I say that knowing full well that I was the one advocating for radical redesigns just a few posts ago...

> I doubt that submitting art on OGA is a live-or-die proposition for anyone who comes here, but I would prefer to see it not change so much that people are bewildered until they adjust just in time to wreck it again with OGA v4.

I agree with this 110%.  The current submit process works just fine, please don't upend it for the sake of change or addressing some minor quibbles.  I'm sure we could all come up with a dozen or so things the current process doesn't do right, but it is a single page process, located a single click off the main page.  Please do not add so much as one more click to that process!

> There's no good fix for creators who submit art in such a way that it doesn't format well.

Agree with this.

> Custom thumbnails and a fixed size (or a size recommendation)

Just giving a size and/or aspect recommendation for the preview images would be address 90% of the issue.   What you are seeing in the data now is just the predictable result of going years and years with no guidance on the size/shape/number of preview images.   That said, the current 'anything is accepted' policy works very well as it allows artists to handle all kinds of corner cases, like submitting a large work with many different environments, etc.   So let's just keep that but toss up a suggesting for the size/aspect and a note that the first image given is what will appear on the preview thumbnails for a submission.

so...

> Should I auto zoom in on images that have bad proportions,

Just scale them to whatever the thumbnail size is.  It's simpler, works 90% of the time and you'll save yourself the headache of trying to AI up the perfect zoom algorithm.  One note though, if possible, use an unfiltered when upscaling 2D art. 

> re: social vs. submit vs. browse

OGA has been around for something like 7-8 years now.  Great high-quality submissions are still flowing in daily, the community while not huge is strong,varied (programmers, artists, etc) and engaged, and have heard few complaints about the site's browse-ability.  So I think you could say the current layout strikes a very good balance.  Maybe it's not perfect but there's 7-8 years of real world example to show that it works pretty darned well.

Deviant Art and Furfinity both lean almost 100% towards 'browse', which I can tell you is 100% the wrong direction for OGA.  I don't need research for that one, just simple math: no community = no patreon support  = no website

(speaking of which, where did the patreon link on the front page disappear to?)

Even samuncle's layout, while visually appealing, leans too far towards browse and submit.  Well, I mean it cuts out community entirely so by default it strikes the wrong balance.

> but I think currently samuncle's layout looks very generic, almost like one of those domain squatting pages :p

I see where you are coming from with this.  I would definitely put the OGA logo and Sara back in there.

> @withthelove If the front end of the layout works, keep it. That was my rationale and I don't see how it contradicts our goals. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if it's clean and stable under the hood which we're doing anyway you can mess around with the shiny stuff more later.

I think the point MedicineStorm was making is that the new under the hood tech won't work with the existing display/layout tech, so a re-write is required even if the goal is maintaining the exact same layout.

That said, I'll admit that I probably came on too strong about making big changes.  My thinking was, the current layout works so don't break it unless you've got something special up your sleeve. In hindsight though, the fact that the current layout has worked so well for so many for so long augurs for hanging onto as much of it as possible.  So at this point, I'm willing to entertain pretty much anything from a slight tweak to a wholesale revamp.

> Any ideas on how to bring back the community stuff?

Just bring it all back.  Bring it back exactly as it is now, a big busy sidebar that's not perfect but has done the job for years.  You can twiddle it from there.  But yeah, a ticker or a menu drop down are not going to be a fair substitute.

Finally, I want to apologize if I came off as a bit curmudgeonly earlier.  All I can say is the idea of changing OGA really struck a chord with me.  I've actually done a lot of thinking about why, and I guess it just comes down to I really love this place and so I'm naturally anxious about any changes to it.  That said, now that I've had time to absorb the idea, I'm very excited about the re-design and certainly grateful to MedicineStorm and Botanic and any others that are working hard to make it happen.

@withthelove thanks for taking the time to look at the pages I designed. 

The focus with my design was the community, the artwork for the most page is the front page of coarse but when looking to use OGA as a tool I felt keeping most stuff within a community page really emphasise the community and the participation here. Submissions , seeing the active comps, posts etc, sadly I never really got finished, I terms of a friends list would of been available as a log in page, seeing a much more personal page preference. previous searches, downloads, messages, as it is now I suppose but perhaps a little more tailored, or tailorable. I tried to keep the design the same as much as I could, without changing to much, that is maybe still recognisable. As for the Patreon link, well, il be honest here, I actually see the patreon page as a negative for OGA. It's been dormant for so long now that anyone clicking on it will immediately feel that this is not worth the effort. Sorry but that's how I see it.:( I could be added at any moment though.

ive said it before and say it again, I don't actually see any problem with how OGA is now, only that the bug fixes are sorted.:)

 Edit: not sure about the featured art? I think it's older stuff submitted as oposed to community voted.

"(speaking of which, where did the patreon link on the front page disappear to?)"

As others have said, it was pretty out-of-date. I removed it until we can get it current.

"Edit: not sure about the featured art? I think it's older stuff submitted as oposed to community voted."

"Featured art" is a random sampling of the most community-voted submissions. It has nothing to do with age. Although it is difficult for newer art to achive that level of favorites quickly, I feel like it is a great feature that showcases some of the most incredible assets this site has to offer.

I love the idea of having short front-page "advertisements" for contestant winners. I think I (and many other artists) would love the opportunity to prominently show off our stuff on this site. It would definitely encourage me to passionately compete in the challenges and contests. Yes, consistent art challenges are a must moving forward. I don't always have time to host the full thing, though. If we get a few volunteers to commit to helping with the various parts, I'm sure we can set up user permissions (in OGA3) to grant access to the volunteers:

• determining a theme and timeline
• setting up the announcements
• vote tallying
• announcing winners and attributing medals
• posting winner's "victory page" to the front until next contest, etc. 

These aren't individual tasks for each volunteer. Everyone can do all parts if they feel like it. It's just the stuff we'd all be helping with.

I agree the current layout is pretty darn great (bugs aside) but I feel a few minor tweaks could take those good ideas and help them be realized even more. The social links are good, but I feel like the way they are laid out could be adjusted. A lot of the stuff on both sidebars is unneccessarily taking up valuable showcasing real estate IMO. One sidebar with recent posts, recent comments, ect. is enough in my opinion. 

I'd like to find some way to emphasize the really good collections, but I don't feel like "popular art collections" really does that well. "favorite submitters this month" and "popular art this month" also seems redundant when the visual "popular art this week" ulitmately does a better job leading people to the same place. Same thing for "New art collections"; the visual "Latest art" (and generally browsing the art and seeing what collections its in) does a better job showing people new art collections.

"Who's online" and "Affiliates" could also be moved to the one sidebar, but moved down toward the bottom. They don't need to be above the fold; I might view them, but they aren't so important that I need to see them right up top without having to scroll down.

the "Chat with us" feature is certainly an important social feature, but I'll bet there's a plugin that makes it much easier than it is now; IRC restricted accounts to registered-nicks-only for spam reasons, which made it somewhat difficult/confusing for a lot of users to jump on the channel and hang out. I've seen other sites have an embedded chat feature; if you're logged into OGA, you're one click away from chatting with others in the OGA channel. no need to re-authenticate with a separate utility using different credentails. What do you guys think?

It is very interesting to see this feedback. Thank you all for contributing and please continue to let us know which ideas you do and do not like. :)

Regarding a chat: yes and no... it drives away communication from a forum and thus can make it appear dead, but I guess that is a general trend.

But if you implement a chat please no walled garden. XMPP or Matrix both federate and can be set up to link with Drupal accounts. XMPP is a bit lighter on server resources and also more mature, but Matrix is a bit easier to bridge to other networks such as Discord or IRC.

hello. my advice as a consumer  (i have not the skills to add assets) of this site.

First, some suggestions about content structure to ease (in my opinion) navigation in the site.

- add a notice (in asset presentation page) to explain how to get credit file (and so collection) & add button download credit for individual assets

- add a notice (in collection page) to explain what are collection for (assets that comes together ? video game project ?) // personally i always keep my assets library locally because i doubt between some assets until the end of the game dev.

- add a clear and concise paragraph/scheme at beginning of homepage to answer the five Ws (who, what, where, when, how,  how many (optionnal), why / for what)

- many things are in FAQ.... FAQ is for motivated people : try to answer question before people have to go in FAQ

( - i would love to have an API to use OGA from my scripts )

Second, some thoughts  about the main topic points 1) and 5):

1) About GIFs, this is effectively complex.  And there is 2 points.
A good example of the problem is : https://opengameart.org/content/cat-fighter-sprite-sheet
where we see N times the same pictures and have to click to see the animation on a previewer over the page.

Below my opinion with reasonning.

a) When animate ?
If we look in many search engines, GIF are animated on click.

When clicked,  it open/unhide a preview block that play the animation. For exploring one by one the images, it is pretty enjoyable.
This design is probably motivated by the fact that hover is not usable on smartphones/tablet pc.

So on user side, i think there's 2 good solutions:
- the "click for animate"  like used by popular search engine can work very well.
  In fact this similar to the current behavior on the differences that (on duckduckgo for example):
   - the preview window don't hide other contents
   - the size of the previewer is stable.
- the "hover for animate", sadly not compatible with tablet/smartphone, but easier to implement that previous one.

Too, in order to easy identify a GIF from other images , the same kind of indicators that are on videos sharing site could be used , that is a rectangle with duration.Too it can be usefull to show number of frames.

b) About the choice of the preview;  going back the the aim of the site : assets for video games.

For example, in point&click games, hover make only appear the name of the element, the animation is played on click (action). It is fun, i made a choice and accepted the action, and i don't want animation played while i was on simple observation.

This is the subject : observation phase (hover or focus) before action (click).

In observation, it could be usefull to have the key moments (start postion -  illustration of move - end position ////// or just the illustration of move in cat fighter example) as a preview.
I don't think these moments can be analysed by a simple algorithm.
The contributor have to choose what is the key moment of the GIF (it could be done by a time cursor interface, but if someone can do an animated image of good quality, this person can easily take the key images from the source).

5) About adding a "left and right" preview button for if someone has more then one preview image. I like the idea, and more could it be combined with a timed preview sequence on hover .

This is what the new design looks on a 39" 1080p screen using Firefox on Linux, using both the newer v60 ESR version and the Palemoon derivative that still supports oldschool XUL addons:

How is this look ok for anyone? Thats why if you crawl up a ways to see my comment, I mention being designed for tablets. And please, don't ask me to try it on Chrome, Chromium, IE, Edge, etc. instead because that's not the point. I can't be the only one that sees this.

@TheOuterLinux: what are you suggesting as an alternative? I can definitely see how that is not a good look, but saying "this plan sucks" doesn't count as an alternative plan.

@TheOuterLinux: Just to confirm you are not seeing things, that is the same way the page at http://199.180.155.219 renders on my laptop (Window 10 Firefox) and my desktop (Windows 10 Chrome) and my tablet (IOS 12 safari), so it's definitely not an issue with your choice of browser or platform, the page layout is just borked of it's own accord.   To be honest, I don't remember it looking this insane when I first discovered this thread a few weeks back, so maybe we are just catching it in a malformed state due to someone being in the middle of working on it.  On the otherhand, it's possible it was always like this and I am just confusing that page with the many other alternatives that have been presented.

@MedicineStorm: I agree folks should strive to provide constructive feedback, but I don't think TheOuterLinux was intending to pile on or be overly negative.  The page at http://199.180.155.219 really does look a mess right now.  Also, TheOuterLinux did express a preference for mirroring the current page and a rationale for doing so (not forcing users to learn a new interface), so the comments were not without any suggestion of an alternate solution.

Is there no interest in having an art challenge for 'Re-Design The OGA Homepage'?   This thread almost seems to have become an art challenge itself and I think it might be cool to see what the broader OGA communitity might come up with.

@WithTheLove: Ah. I see. Thank makes more sense. It seemed obvious to me there was no intent to implement the example layout exactly as it is now, but was instead intended to be a "first step" demonstration of a potential layout. Looks like that was not quite as obvious to others. Still, as you say, if there is something we don't like about the example layout, we should be discussing how to improve it beyond "this layout is borked! It should be fixed!" 

@TheOuterLinux: Sorry, I thought you were previously saying the layout should be kept and have no new layout at all, not that the new layout should try to imitate the current one. Is that what you are suggesting? I assumed this more recent response was attempting to add a new suggestion.

I am interested in an OGA layout art challenge! that sounds fun, but there doesn't seem to be enough interest in hosting the art challenges. As I mentioned earlier, I don't have enough time to handle the basic site administration as well as art challenges by myself (not counting my other time-consuming obligations :) If anyone is interested in helping out, let's do this! :D

i offered to do the art challenge i think, but @Danorder had it  under control, then you did a good job too. may i suggest that this thread be the art challenge as suggested by withthelove, and then who ever wins the challenge creates the new art challenege, or the 'winner' of each challenge creates the next art challenge?. id be more than happy to do it if no one else wants to. :)

I'd be happy to run an Art Challenge for this.  I guess it would be a bit different than other challenges, in that submissions would just be screenshots or links to demo pages.   We wouldn't require anything to be functional, so even just PNG mock-ups done in PS, GIMP, etc. would be accepted.  That way even folks with no web programming background or access to hosting for a demo page could contribute.

@chasersgaming:  I had an idea about how to handle running the art challenges but when I wrote it up, it seemed like it was getting kind of off topic for this thread, so I started a new thread to discuss ideas on that.  Here's the link for that discussion:

https://opengameart.org/forumtopic/sharing-art-challenge-duties

@MedicineStorm:  I do hear a lot of voices in here saying they like the current layout, but I think you can always safely read that as a suggestion to replicate/imitate the current layout with whatever new code/layout you come up with.  I don't think anyone is saying you should try and use the exact same layout/code from the current page since as you've already made it clear that that isn't technically feasible.   I don't think anybody particularly cares what goes on behind the scenes, we are all just giving suggestions for how the final page should look.

@Botanic: There's not enough presented on the front page. The captions are off center and I don't like the background gradient. I think the concept presented here needs some work before it can be adopted.

@withthelove: given my main area of talent is web design, I'd love to participate in an art challenge for that. Your concept has a pretty nice layout by the way.

Hello people,

I do not participate much on the forums, but i'd like to chime in.

I am a full stack web developer, i know php,html,css,js(among many other back-end languages and frameworks and many of the popuplar front-end frameworks(vue,angular,react), i can do everything vanilla js too.) This project clearly needs help, and i want to help but i need a few pointers and have few questions.

Do you actually want outside help apart from comments/criticism ? I see it has a perlimnary version of the drupal theme is on github, so i assume "yes". 

If that's a yes, how much help do you want? Do you only want css/html/js coding help? do you also want design help? Do you need any php/backend help?

Do you need the work done directly on the drupal theme or just need the html/css/js files and go from there?

@Botanic thank you for working on this. If not for the irregular grid, I would favor http://199.180.155.219/ over the current homepage.

@Samuncle ( https://samuncle.github.io/opengameart-new-gui/ ) gorgeous work.

1. Title length breaks layout. Solution: white-space:nowrap; text-overflow: ellipsis; https://i.imgur.com/N0F42RI.png

2. Title placement should be below image

3. responsive webdesign is missing (sketchfab has excellent width limits https://sketchfab.com/models/popular ).

4. General de-clutter. https://i.imgur.com/2p204jy.png 1. huge title/call-to-action, 2. large section titles, 3. wasted space around thumbnails

In general I would suggest to learn/copy/steal a lot of the UX from https://sketchfab.com/models/popular . No, sketchfab doesn't share OGA's values and goals but some goals (growth) match and some methods (growth through attractive presentation of user content) can match. :)

If I had the burden of processing the feedback, I would pick one and only one purpose of the page that is supposed to be designed for (landing page for guests) and focus on one purpose only (impress them). Maybe later there'd be time to implement a dashboard landing page for logged in users (or simply a dashboard) that is more community-focused.

5) I am thinking to make the previews a bit smaller with a border around them, still larger than the current ones but smaller than now. Was also thinking to add a "left and right" preview button for if someone has more then one preview image. Thoughts?

Sounds cool but complicated to implement and mobile-unfriendly. I'd focus on one preview and in a future project see if the upload form needs improvement.

8) Should I auto zoom in on images that have bad proportions, ie 10px x 500px or stick to showing the (almost useless?) super zoomed out image?

I would ignore the effect on submissions with non 16:9 thumbnails and find solutions (uploading requires 16:9) later.

@quadraxas: Yes, we would like outside help beyond just critiques. :)

css/html/jp/php/backend help would be great. 

"Do you need the work done directly on the drupal theme or just need the html/css/js files and go from there?"

Both(?) Work can be done directly on the drupal theme AND we could use modified/new html/css/js files.